Episode 43: Laughter

Welcome to Wisdom from the Aerial View, the podcast for those who wish to learn how to crush their anxiety and find meaning and purpose in their lives. The name of this program is called Wisdom from the Aerial View, the superpower that can change your life and this world. How are you this morning? This afternoon, Dr. Klein, what's new?

I'm great. Everything's cool. It's great to see you as always. You can always tell whenever I see you I get a smile. That's true. It's true.

Good. It's great to be seen and it's great to see you. I like that. okay, let's talk about smiles. In fact, let's talk about laughter today because in the old days, was a Reader's Digest. I don't even know if Reader's Digest still exists anymore. Does it? Okay. And they had this, in the beginning of every Reader's Digest, it was said, laughter is the best medicine. And then I'm looking at your wonderful book.

Hmm.

I think it still does. I think it does.

called Wisdom from the Aerial View and you have a chapter called Lighten Up and I want to talk about that today. I want to read from it and you had no idea I was going to do this but that's okay. I know that's okay. You're laughing okay. You said and I quote, what is fair game for laughter? Everything except a short list. Loss, war, terrorism,

I had no idea. But I'm laughing, that's good.

Poverty, injury and disease, especially in children. Cruelty, violence and brutality. Are we permitted to make fun of others? Yes, as long as the intent is to generate smiles and not to disguise one's intention to harm a person or a group. Humor today is a mess. Comedians are afraid to say anything. You go on to say, if one is so fragile that a joke can undo them, More is likely in play in that psyche. Let comedians go. Sometimes you have to give a little to get a lot. When we bristle at jokes that poke fun at us, we break a cardinal rule. Don't take yourself too seriously. We have complete control over how we choose to respond to any situation. That superpower is always available. There's so many things to talk about in that just that one paragraph alone. So let's start. You talk about let comedians go. Recently, we find that's not happening. So let's talk first about humor. You say everything's humorous except those certain things and you're absolutely right. So why should we laugh at ourselves more? And in so doing, should we laugh at the world?

we should be laughing all the time. You know that you make fun of me when I tell you I laugh before I go into surgery.

Yes, I think that's a little bit crazy.

Yeah, it's a little crazy. But because I look at the world, obviously, from the aerial view and a different point, and every moment of my story is just another page in my book, and they're all equivalent, they're all equal, and this is true for not just my book, it's true for everybody's book, everybody's story of their life. Every page contributes equally. There's no one moment in your life that at the end of your life is going to... jump off, make one page light up and the rest of not. It seems that there are moments that are more significant, but every page contributes to our story. So for that reason, we should embrace every page. We've talked about the fact that as you get older, it's not as much fun in a lot of ways. You wake up, this hurts, that hurts, something's happening, whatever. That's because you're comparing it to the way it was years earlier when you just leapt out of bed and run around and do everything you want. But this page that you're on in your book towards the latter years is no different in value and importance than a page earlier in your story. So you should embrace them all. Because of that, most things that happen are kind of funny. Now I have... as an observer, because in the aerial view you have to become that independent detached observer. So you're watching yourself as if you're watching somebody else. So I think I don't know if I ever told you this story. We were still, I was in college at this point. We had left high school and I was working at the beach, Atlantic beach, close to our houses where I worked every summer for many years. And there was a girl, I think I was I'm going to guess I was 18 and she was probably 16 or 17. And this girl was beautiful, right? And she was I think we were three years ahead of her. So I don't think we were in high school at the same time we left. And then because I was, as you know, I was the youngest person on our class or just about anyway.

So even though she was in high school, we were there and now I was in college, we were only less than two years apart in age, maybe 20 months apart in age. Nothing when you think about it, right? But at that point it's a big deal. Anyway, this beautiful girl and I had such a crush on her and she'd been going out with a guy I knew and he broke up with her for some... ridiculous reason, which I didn't ever think he was the smartest bulb in the lamp. Right. He wasn't the brightest bulb in the lamp, but this proved it to me. Anyway, so I'm thinking she's not going to pay any attention to me, even though I'm older. I'm now in college. Forget it. I don't have, you know, this is out of my league. So I get my one day. I OK, what the heck? Let's just go for it. So I call her up.

you

And I said, you want to go to the movies Friday night? And I remember this is a long time ago. So it's not like it is today, right? We were closer to the Victorians than we are to what's happening today. So I call her up, you know, on her home line. I think her mother answered the phone or whatever. And I say, would you like to go to the movies Friday night? And she said, she says, I'm sorry, I can't. I'm busy. And my card, of course, sings up because this is exactly what I thought I was going to hear. And then five seconds later, as a pause, goes, but I'm babysitting. You want to come over to where I'm babysitting? And I went, wow, really? Now, of course, can you imagine now a family letting, who has a young girl babysitting, letting a guy come over to the house while she's babysitting the kids? This shows you how different the world is, right? But that wasn't a big deal then. So I go over there and we have this, we're sitting around talking, you know, she's watching the kids, the kids go to sleep. They're little kids.

Uh-huh.

By the time I got there, think the kids were asleep. And then we were just chatting, maybe watching TV. I don't really remember. Just went on for a couple of hours and it was time for me to go. I didn't stay all that long. And we get to the door. And of course, you know, now what do I do? Right. It's going pretty well. Right. I think she's kind of interested, but I'm just really not sure. And I decide, what the heck? So I kiss her. And it was probably...

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

I don't remember so many kisses in my life, but I remember that one. That's right. I do. And I walked out of the So I'm like, my feet are not hitting the ground. Right. I walk out of the house, you know, I walk out backwards, saying good night, waving to her. I turn around and walk right into a tree. Slam, bang, right into the tree. Right. Walk could be more embarrassing. OK. Now, of course, I was terribly embarrassed. I think she laughed and I laughed.

I'm sure you do, yeah.

But I was, my God, you're such a moron. You're such an idiot, right? But even at that point I laughed and now I think it's just the greatest metaphor for how you should live your life. Everybody walks into trees all the time. I don't care who you are. You could be have the highest level job. You could be CEO of a corporation. You could be a politician. You could be anything. You are going to walk into a tree pretty regularly. Right. Maybe not as much as you get older. You are going to walk into that tree. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to make 10,000 excuses and blame the tree? We talked about blame recently. We're to blame the tree. We're going to blame somebody else for not telling us the tree was there. You know, what are we going to do? Right. Well, the best thing you could do is laugh about it. And here's why. And you know this, I don't have to tell you this. I you're one of the funniest people I've ever met in my life. It's so, it's liberating. Laughter is liberating. It is just freedom at its ultimate level. Everybody feels great when they're laughing. I mean, there's very few emotions that beat that. Maybe not any actually. And so...

Mm-hmm.

That's the key thing. You know, you can laugh at everything except that short list that you rattled off in the beginning, right? You don't want to be laughing at those things. They're not funny. Nobody finds them funny. But pretty much everything else is fair game, right? So those metaphorical trees, you should be laughing, right? Because you're going to because they're just part of your life. And when you do that, A, you feel great. Number two is it builds up your own

All right.

that persona that we talked about, that person of substance, this all adds to it. The ability to laugh at yourself, to not take yourself too seriously. That is a, that should be a crime. You should be arrested for taking yourself too seriously.

Yeah, but let me go back to something you say in here again. I'm going to say humor and make it kind of heavier, but you say, humor today is a mess. Comedians are afraid to say anything. If one is so fragile that a joke can undo them, more is likely in play in that psyche. So, so let's talk about that because we see that happening today. Why are we so thin skinned that we can't make fun of things ourselves or something else. I mean remember when we were kids there was a guy whose name was Don Rickles and he would make fun of people. He would just say things about people and I would sit and I would just laugh and howl and that he could not exist today. His humor would not make it today. So what happened between then and now that we can't seem to poke fun at ourselves? Why is that? Why are we not The name of this chapter is Lighten Up. Why are we not lightening up? Why is that?

because we're way too fragile. And the reason we're too fragile is we've grown up in a society that has not allowed us to create, to develop self-esteem in the correct manner. You know, we joke around about, you know, we live in a society where every kid gets a trophy, every kid on the soccer team gets a trophy, right? It's a big deal. Because you cannot give somebody self-esteem. It cannot be wrapped in a bow and left on the doorstep or under the Christmas tree. Self-esteem doesn't work that way. It has to be earned. We know what we've earned. We know when we've been given something that we don't deserve, that we haven't earned. It's the problem in our schools now. We graduate kids who can't read effectively or can't do math. They know it. Everybody knows it. So what are you doing? You're creating a person who says, I'm not worthy. I'm incomplete. I can't handle this world. So I'll either kill myself, which suicide is at high rate, you know very well, or I'll hurt somebody else so I can make something, I'll be a big man, I'll make something more of myself. So this idea of... fragility is because we haven't developed the self-esteem we need. There's no shortcut to self-esteem. It comes mostly through accomplishments. You have to do things of significance. You have to start from scratch and build something, learn something, make yourself skilled at something. That's where self-esteem comes from. And if you don't have that, then you are this fragile personality who could, the analogy I use is as if you're balanced on a single stone and a strong wind will blow you over. You have to have a foundation where both your legs are encased in concrete. so no wind is going to blow you or unless it's a hurricane five level wind you know which will blow anybody over

that you won't get blown over. So we have not developed that self-esteem, that persona we talk about, that person of substance. We haven't developed it from childhood on in the current generations. And we're doing them a tremendous disservice. And that's why they're so fragile. That's why you need safe spaces. And there are trigger words. Come on, right? You and I roll our eyes at this going, because we grew up and we talked about, I think we talked about this.

Right, yeah.

because I'm sure you were involved with this. So those of you who don't know, probably if you've been listening, know how funny she is. But she's lightning quick, right? And so being, and she's very smart and lightning quick and funny. That's a tremendous combination. So when we were growing up, we had these rank out sessions, right? We'd insult each other. We'd stand around and just insult each other. Can you imagine that today, right? Calling each other names and insulting our families and everything, right? Everything you could think about. And the person who would...

Hmm?

No, wouldn't happen. Right.

who could do the most quickly and have that quick retort, that was the winner, right? And we all practiced and we got better at it. I used to joke around when I was at my office, if somebody would start with some kind of, one of my colleagues would start saying something and picking on me, which I could care less about. But I would look at him go, you really don't want to go down this road. because I'm pretty good at this. I grew up doing this, right? You're going to lose, right? So, you know, it's fine with me. I love doing this, but I'm not sure you're ready. That kind of thing, you know, because we were comfortable with it. that's because A, we were beating around with it as kids. And we had to do things as kids that people weren't giving you stuff. You you weren't good enough to make the team. You didn't make the team, right? You weren't good enough to get an A or B. You weren't getting an A or B, right? We got Cs all over the place, right? So, you know, C was average. when we were growing up. The average grade was C. Right? C is average. B means you do better than average and A is you're exceptional. Well now it's nothing like that. this artificial self-esteem that we've doled out over the last couple of generations creates a society of people who are very fragile and God forbid you say something that offends them, they fall apart. That's what I was talking about.

But we even take it now to the, to me, the ultimate. If you say something that's on the air that I don't like, we can actually have you take it off of the air. I think when we're talking about things like this, we are, I, I, I'm nervous that we're at a point in society where we are so fragile, your word, and we are, that, that our, our tolerance level is nil. So if you say something I don't like, I'm going to take you off the air. I'm not going to listen to you. Now.

you

The beauty of it is I can turn the dial. I can actually turn you off. But it doesn't mean I'm going to replace you. I'm going to take you physically off the air and you can't have your show anymore. We know that with Stephen Colbert. We saw that with Jimmy Kimmel. Are we so afraid of laughing at ourselves that we've gotten to a point where we're actually canceling people? And why? Why have we gotten there?

Well, the irony is we've been canceling people forever and what you're seeing now is the reaction to that. We talked about this previously, the overreaction. Why we have the government we have now is it's always the government you have now is always a reaction to the government you had before. That's the way it works. So the government we had before, people didn't like the cultural things that were going on in this country and they went way over to the other side and reacted that way. That's what happens. It's not, that's why, you I look at this and I see, I see problems from, I don't see one side as any different than the other. I see, I see them as, if not totally equivalent, close enough, right? We're not going to solve the problem by blaming this on one side or the other. We have to understand that we are not helping people develop. these personalities, these psyches that can withstand these very minimal fronts, this college campus stuff, these safe spaces and trigger warnings. What? Microaggressions. The first time I heard the word microaggression, I was like, what is a microaggression? I know what a macroaggression is. You hit me with a stick, right? You threw a ball at my head, right? That's a macroaggression. What is a microaggression? Then I learned what it was. went, come on, you're kidding. We talked about this and we talked about sticks and stones, you know, can break your bones and words can never harm you. What we grew up with now, you know, words are

Yes.

small little atomic weapons, right? So, which is ridiculous because if you have, if you grow up with enough self-esteem and enough... become a person of substance and you have that foundation, that strong foundation, you don't care if somebody says something to you. First of all, the microaggressions by themselves are idiotic, but even the sense that you could be triggered by a word or you need to say space, that's telling you you're too fragile. You're way too fragile. In fact, not only you're fragile, you're fragilissimo in Italian. You're just way off the farm. We got to build you up. We got to put you in the psychological gym, right? other thing is have so many people go to therapists now and I don't want to beat up on therapists but if you're going to a therapist and you've been at the same therapist for years, there's a problem, right? You shouldn't need therapy for years. You might need a couple of pointers to say, okay, here's how we get you get back on track and build that persona, build that self-esteem, become a person of substance. The things we talk about every episode in this podcast, how to control your stress and so on, how to view the world in a much more productive way, the Viktor Frankl rule, et cetera. These are the tools we need to give young people, especially everybody, but especially young people. So they don't have to worry about microaggressions and trigger warnings and safe spaces and nonsense like that. And they don't have to worry about comedians saying something that is maybe a quote offense to them. My favorite, my personal favorite. I don't watch the Academy Awards very often. My wife likes it. So we have watched and I don't know how many years ago is now five years ago when

Jada Pinkett Smith, yeah, when Jada Pinkett Smith was sitting with Will Smith at that table and poor Chris Rock made a joke about her hair, right, because she had been in that movie, I forget the name of the movie, you know what I'm talking about. Not a ship, there had been a movie of a person with a short, anyway, fine, she makes this joke about her hair, it's a nothing. And Will Smith gets up and slaps him across the face, right? So you might say,

Will Smith.

Right. Enid (18:04.0) I do.

If you want to call it a microaggression, I don't believe in microaggressions, but he made a joke. And instead of making a joke back and laughing, which is what Will Smith should have done, he should have laughed, right? And Jada Pinkett Smith should have laughed because we shouldn't take ourselves too seriously. And if Jada Pinkett Smith has alopecia and is losing her hair, she should be able to laugh at that too. That's part of your life, Jada. Everybody has stuff. Some people have acne. Some people have, you know, physical deformations. Some people lose their hair. I've lost my hair, you don't see me freaking out about it, right? So the point is that you have to be, not take yourself too seriously. And then when you do take yourself too seriously, then you become vulnerable to these little actions that are, and you react way out of proportion. So I saw Will Smith do that. He was my, he was a part that struck me over the next day or two. There were a lot of people in Hollywood who thought that was perfectly fine. He was standing up for his wife. No, he wasn't standing up for his wife, right? He assaulted somebody for a joke. he didn't like the joke, right? He didn't call her a horrible thing, right? He didn't use one of the words we hear all the time from from dark comics. He made a joke that was actually OK for network TV. It wasn't that big a deal. So but when you're so fragile, right? Like Jada Pinkett Smith obviously was. And I don't know the woman. I'm sure she's lovely. I wish her only the best. But if she's that fragile. then that's a problem. It's not Chris Rock's problem. It's Jada Pinkett Smith's problem. It's obviously Will Smith's problem, right? Because he lost it, right?

Well, he was one of the stretch. I will say this, though, that I think I'll take issue with one thing. I think younger people are they're the ones going to comedy clubs so they understand that we can laugh at things. They understand that we can laugh at ourselves. I think it's older people who are having problems with humor. think people our age who say they are offended by things. I will say that I look. Yeah, I do. I don't know. I mean, I think younger people going to comedy clubs.

You really think so? Maybe you're right. I don't know.

Comedians are younger when we were growing up. They were older. The comedians themselves were older. Nowadays, they're younger. And they're, I think, more able to laugh at themselves. And I think it's old people who are getting offended by the younger people making jokes about culture, about race, about whatever that sex. I looked up the definition of humor. Why do I look up definitions? I don't know, but I did. Maybe because it's so I can laugh at them. But this is from psychology today, the definition of humor. Quote, humor, the capacity to express or perceive what's funny is both a source of entertainment and a means of coping with difficult or awkward situations and stressful events. Although it provokes laughter, humor can be serious business. From its most lighthearted forms to its more absurd ones, humor can play an instrumental role in framing societal bonds, releasing tension or attracting a mate. So I think, which I like, yes, attracting a mate, because you might be more inclined to like somebody who's got a sense of humor than one who doesn't, you know? But I think it's interesting, I mean, the definition sort of intrigued me, because humor can help us cope with difficult or awkward situations. I think that's what humor's about.

Wow, tracking a mate. I like that.

think it's why you wrote a chapter on lighten up.

Yeah, it can. I agree with that. You know, I'm thinking we had our friend Alan's Y Bell on a while ago and we need to ask him this question, what he thinks about it, because it's right up his alley since he's he is a comedian and a comedy writer. You know, you know, that that I'm sure that psychology today.

You're right.

analysis is correct and it's in psychology today so you know they're going to take it to a different level. I was thinking when you're reading it I'm thinking well you know the three students just smacked each other with a frying pan it wasn't that deep you know. Yeah so sometimes sometimes humor is deeper but most of the time it's like walking into the tree like when I walked in the tree or getting you know or Jerry Lewis one of those physical comics from years past doing something silly and yeah it's a release it's a release and we all need a release. It's like I said

Right? Yeah, right.

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

It's probably the single greatest emotion because you are literally flying at the moment of laughter. I remember being with my friends, some of our friends from years past, and laughing so hard tears are coming down my cheeks, right? And there is absolutely nothing better than that. it makes it is telling you this is a great reason to be alive.

Sure, sure.

Yeah, it's a release. It's a release, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And what I would say, it's that release, it's that incredible joy. You it's why, you you and I have talked a lot about suicide and you know a lot about it, especially in older people. And I was talking to somebody about this recently and they said something that I've told my kids that people who commit suicide don't believe it's ever going to get any better or it's ever going to be any different. And the best thing I think you could do to people in that situation is show them it could be different and make them laugh. Because when you laugh, all of a sudden the darkness is gone. And one laughter is not going to be your last laugh. I mean, you're going to have a lot more laughs in life. You're going to have tears, like you said. You're going to have sorrow. You're have tough times. But that laughter is out there, right? Which is why I think you and I have talked this. I don't know if I wrote about this at all. I'm sure I wrote about it somewhere. But I've been in funerals and I have a hard time not laughing. I do.

This I will never understand this. Okay.

I have a heart. Well, first of all, listening to people talk about the deceased sometimes is funny. I've given a bunch of eulogies in my life and I've always made people laugh during the eulogy because they want to, right? Because it's a tough thing to go through when you're at a funeral. So everybody loves that moment of laughter. Everybody loves it. It's, I don't have to be so sad for 10 seconds or a minute, whatever it is, right? So. You can laugh at funerals, it's okay. You can't make fun of people at funerals, I wouldn't recommend that. But my point is not that you should be laughing at funerals, but that every event, except the one that list that you made in the beginning that I wrote, is game for laughter. And why wouldn't you laugh? Why do you want to be mired in sorrow? If you have the option of being mired in sorrow laughing,

Yeah.

Why wouldn't you choose laughter? Do you think it's inappropriate? Is it unfair? Is it disrespectful? Most of the time it's not any of those things. You can respect somebody and have regard for... an event that is not one of those that I listed like terrorism or child abuse and so on. And there's always an element of that that can make you laugh. Choose laughter as often as you can. Why wouldn't you? This life is a limited time only. When you add up all the moments of your life, at the end, if you had more moments of tears than you did of laughter, That's unfortunate, right? You don't want that to happen. You want the ratio to be the opposite. You want to have many more moments of laughter than sorrow. You don't get points for being sad. You don't get points for avoiding laughter when you know it will help you and those around you, right? You're trying to make the world better for people. You're trying to help as many people as you can. I guarantee you, you make them laugh. That's the best thing you can do. That's why we love comedians. They're so great. People who can write and laugh like our friend, Alan Zweibel, who can light humor. Fantastic. I think that is just such a gift, a gift from God to be able to do that, but a gift to all those people who you entertain, who you make laugh and smile. You are doing God's work on earth when you do that. So that's why you should laugh and make light whenever you can. Lighten up.

I couldn't agree with you more. Yes, absolutely. I agree. I agree. And you know, some of our best politicians, interestingly enough, use humor. And it's a very serious business. But if you can inject some humor, and I would actually say that one of the things I believe that attracted a lot of people to Donald Trump was he was funny. I used to in the beginning when when he was just starting out, I used to watch because for entertainment, I thought this guy's funny. Little did I realize he was serious. But he was funny, yeah.

But he is, let me just say one thing. He is still funny. So while you're wringing your hands.

Yeah.

It is also okay to laugh because this too shall pass as my mother would say. This is not a forever thing. Nothing's forever. Life is cycled, right? It's a sine wave some way one way or another. It's going to change. It always changing. Change is the only thing that's constant as a matter of fact. So it's okay to laugh at these things. It's just fine. You don't have to feel guilty. I'm laughing at Donald Trump. He's a horrible human being. No, you might not like anything he does.

That's right. Enid (26:51.2) Yes it is.

Well, that's true, isn't it? Yeah.

But it's still okay to laugh when he's funny. That's fine, right? Right.

That's right. Totally agree. Totally agree. So these things go so fast. I look at the clock we're running at. I want to end my part of this. want to, with going back to your chapter on lighten up, because you wrote here, and it's interesting. You wrote, humor's strength lies in its ability to rescue us from the deepest values of our life and lift us up to a higher plane. Sorrow should never be more than a temporary emotion. It will never change a single outcome or enhance a moment of the future. Each of us is on a solo journey toward completing our mission of evolving from selfish to selfless. Taking ourselves or our situation too seriously for any extended period is an unnecessary and unpleasant distraction from our odyssey. We need not be afraid to laugh, even in the darkest of times. Humor is one of life's greatest gifts, and the opportunity to employ it to enhance our lives is a blessing. There is no reason to use it sparingly.

Whoever wrote that? No, exactly. Exactly. Don't use this sparingly. So I'll finish with a little anecdote, right? So this is when humor has gotten me into trouble. Among many other things have gotten me into trouble. But...

I'm telling you, I'm telling you.

Yes.

My wife and I very rarely have a significant argument. We've been married 28 years. I think we've had a handful, maybe less, right? Really serious arguments and none for a long time. But occasionally something will happen and maybe it's my fault, maybe it's not, it doesn't matter. and something will happen and my first reaction is she starts to get, know, and she doesn't very often lose her cool, hardly ever, but when she's upset with me, my initial reaction is to smile and start to laugh. that's the worst thing and I can't help it because I look at this again, I become that independent observer and I'm looking at this situation, I'm thinking, this is so ridiculous and I start to laugh about it. does that make her mad? Right? And I understand that makes her mad and I've tried so hard to control it but my natural inclination is to look at a situation and think it's funny. I'll tell you perfect example. So before we were married, We were with, and I have, I had three kids and we got married and we have one child of our own together, but she's really the mother to all four kids. I mean, if you ask her, she'll tell you she has four children. She's, you know, she's a super unbelievably wonderful person. But something was happening with my older kids and there was some situation, I don't remember the situation, and it was just spiraling downward as families often do in these situations. And I think she was having a discussion with one of the other kids and I could see this. So what do I do? I make the cardinal error of inserting myself in this conversation. By the end, five minutes later, both of them are mad at me, which is fine. I'm okay with that. But I've gone from trying to help to make it worse and now they're both livid with me. So I take my dog at the time and we go outside and I look at him and I go.

Hmm.

Well, that didn't work out too well, it? And I'm laughing with my dog, right? Because I look at this situation again from the aerial view to be the independent observer and realize. Okay, people are upset, people are mad, but it's funny. The whole scene is funny. If you're sitting in a movie theater or we're on a TV and you're watching this, you're watching this family dynamic just spiral out of control. You you look at and start laughing at these people, right? Because it's not your problem, it's their problem. So you're looking at it independently and it's funny, but you can do that in your own life, right? Now, you probably shouldn't do it when you're having an argument with your spouse. It's not a good strategy. It was a bad idea, but you understand my point.

Yeah, I don't think that's a good idea. would, yeah, yeah.

point is that most of these things turn out to be funny at a certain level and the more you can laugh the better off you're going to be.

Well, I will laugh at that and say thank you for you. No, I don't think that if you did that to me, honey, no, no, no, no, no, I don't know. I think there are times when laughter is appropriate and sometimes where it's not appropriate. So I'm with Deneen on that one. So if you're listening to this, Deneen, got you, babe, got you back. Anyway, I'm sure. Yeah. And she was right and you're wrong, but who knows? Anyway, I thank you for your time.

Although I don't think you think it's Yes, I know.

She will.

Usually, by the way, that is the case.

It probably is, but don't blame her. don't blame. I appreciate your time. Thank you, Doc. We will see you next time. Yes?

I never blame her.

All right, thank you. So we will thank you everybody for listening. See you soon. Bye, bye, Aynid.

Peace. Bye bye.